I’m Down and Out
For those who come looking for a short, thoughtful read, a blogging life discussion, or a way to gradually ease back into the week. I offer this bloggy life hypothetical question. . . .
A friend has fallen on hard times. He lost his job and hasn’t been able to replace it. His family is barely getting by. In fact, they’re racking up some serious debt. Now, a year later, he’s about to lose his house. He’s thinking about announcing it on his blog and asking for help — outright asking for money. Many folks from his family, your family, and your community read his blog, including possible future employers.
How do you respond?
–ME “Liz” Strauss
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???
I hope this isn’t anyone I know.
If so, they only need ask…
Sure I’d help – as much as I’m able. What are friends for after all? Friends help their friends out in times of crisis.
There’s a ton of unknowns in the hypothetical situation. But I’m with Joe & Trevor. Having been unemployed (more than once) and on the receiving end of generosity (way more than once) has helped me be a little empathetic to those who are struggling.
At the same time it may be that my hypothetical friend would benefit from the humbling experience that comes from actually asking for help on his blog. I know I was a pretty stinking proud person before I accepted that first unemployment check. (In fact the first time I was unemployed I wouldn’t take it. I ran up bills until I got another job. Dumb.)
Some of us need to be forced into a position where we admit our own weaknesses and accept help. It softens our hearts and makes us more willing to help others in turn.
Hey, Joe,
I don’t think you know the guy. I made him up. 🙂
Hi Trevor,
Great to see you!
Yeah, that’s what friends are for. I love the sound of that phrase — and the three guys who jumped right in to say it. But are you going to let the friend put his tale on the Internet?
Liz,
As Chris said, hypothetically, if a friend needs some help and I can afford it, they just need to ask.
It can be difficult to do (asking I mean) and just as difficult for the friend to offer without insulting.
But, as Trevor said, “that’s what friends are for”…
I’ve asked for help in the past and received it. I try and give when others ask as well. This is what a community.
I’d say yes. Absolutely he should.
Hey Chris,
I think one best thing that ever happened to me was when I was broke in my early 30s and I couldn’t afford to buy someone a drink when we were out. That’s when I realized that people were my friends other than for my generosity. 🙂
Joe,
I hear you. That’s very sensitive of you to consider the feelings of both the friend and the guy who wants to help. 🙂
Hey Zero Boss,
Thanks for stopping over. You guys are friends worth having. You’re right it is what makes a community and holds it together. Still the question is there. Is it a good idea to put it on the Internet.
Maybe it should be an email campaign instead???
Personally I think, if it is a personal request or need, it should be handled one on one.
If it were a request to help a community or some other worthy endeavour, then go public.
That makes sense, Joe. What a great sorting mechanism — personal to personal, public to public.
Liz, et al
I hate to bring personal into such a public place, but K is going in for a biopsy tomorrow AM and I would appreciate any prayers to see her through.
Sorry, this might not be the right place to ask for such a thing, but every little bit helps.
Thanks,
Joe
Hey, Joe, I think it’s a fine place to ask. We’re always listening to a friend with that sort of a request. 🙂
That’s a form of begging, isn’t it? Our hypothetical friend isn’t approaching the people he knows personally. He’s going public and asking for help, which here means donations.
How does this differ from a stranger on the street asking you for spare change? After all, plenty of people he doesn’t know will likely read that blog.
Suppose you didn’t know this man personally? Would you be inclined to give him money? And if yes, what about that stranger in the street asking for change?
Hi Scorpia,
When I wrote the scenario that’s exactly what I thought that it would be begging for money online. It’s something to think about the same as writing personal issues on a blog. It will be there forever.
Your point of drawing a distinction between online and in person is a strong one. I wonder how many people would do one and not the other? I wonder how many already have?
I would advise him to leave it off the blog, because I don’t think it would help his case much now and it would hurt him in the future.
For the reasons Scorpia mentioned (would you trust a stranger on the internet?) I don’t think he would get much, if any, positive response.
The negative, of course, is that his post would be on the internet for a very long time. Future employers would find when searching for him pre-interview, and might be less interested in him because of it.
The only way is one-on-one with trusted friends and relatives. Hopefully, he has been keeping his network informed through the past year. Calling now and asking for help is the only way I can see to get the help. If a friend, relative or trusted networking buddy called me today and asked for help, I would jump at the chance.
Joe,
Prayers for you and K. Good luck tomorrow.
Thanks Kent.
We really do appreciate it.
Joe & K – definitely praying for you both. Best wishes for speedy healing.
To Liz’s question: One-on-one is where money is best asked for, unless you can do it in a cutesy sort of way and turn it into something of value for the giver. Think OneRedPaperClip.com or SaveKaryn.com (now memorialized at http://www.savekaryn-originalsite.com/)
Still, friends are more likely to share their wealth than mere readers, but you never know…
Hi Phil!
Great advice for a friend turn it into value for the giver. Then it’s not begging. It becomes a transaction of exchanging value — a selling proposition. 🙂
I like that. Phil, you always have so many great ideas! But then I should expect that. 🙂
Hey Phil,
Thanks, it may sound redundant, but I mean it.
I appreciate all the good wishes from all.
And Liz, Thank You for tolerating my self pity.
Joe
Joe,
Asking for prayers is not self-pity. Get real. 🙂
I think it was Harvey Mackay years ago who said a really great network includes people that you could call in the middle of the night (if you had to) and ask for a big loan, and they’d probably come through for you. His book was “Dig Your Well Before You’re Thirsty.”
This would mean a one-on-one rather than a public request, and I agree with the other comments that one-on-one is the way to go if you’re stuck like that.
Money is a weird thing; it’s not like asking for a lift as a hitchhiker or help with getting a door open or someone to bring lasagne after the baby arrives . Money comes with a lot of emotional freight, in my experience. Not sure a public plea is the way I’d go, especially on the Web where your words “live forever” whether you like it or not.
Wrong words, right thought… 😉
Thanks.
Nite Liz
Nite All
My prayers are with you and K, Joe. Try to relax.
In a perfect world the person would be able to talk to their family and friends and ask for help. Their family, and hopefully their friends, would have helped as much as they were able. After all, they know he’s been unemployed for a long time. Signs of financial shortage are obvious in a personal relationship.
We don’t live in a perfect world.
From the way you framed the question he’s talking to me before posting the request. If the situation allows it, I would try to delay him while making other arrangements to help and bring up the issues of everyone and his brother seeing a public plea.
But it’s hard, very hard for most people to ask for money in person. It makes them feel like a failure. I would almost guarantee that someone who has gone for over a year without asking for help will see it as a sign of failure. If, like Phil says, he reframed it in terms of a value proposition on the blog, he may be better off. He may have a whole new career. After all, how many blogs have you seen asking for donations? They don’t say “I’m broke. I need help now!” But they do say “If you receive value, please donate.”
Kent,
Sorry, I didn’t mean to overlook you. I saw your response to Joe and totally missed your comment. (duh me)
I’m with you that an future employer would be really turned off to find a post like that on the Internet.
Hi Sheila,
I never would have expected to be getting advice from Harvey MacKay on this one. What a great quote to bring up! I totally forgot about that. It makes me want to dig out all of his old books and reread them.
Money does change the way people act in the moment and ever after. That emotional overlay you talk about can be really long lasting.
Good night, Joe.
Tonight and tomorrow you’ll both be in our prayers and in our thoughts.
We love you.
Liz
Yeah, it made a big impression on me and made me think a lot about networks, both personal and professional and those that are sort of combinations of the two.
I looked at my Christmas card list in a whole new way (not that I picked up the phone and started dialing for dollars, but if I was in a jam, who could I really call?)
I’m just grateful that I haven’t been in that situation, but it could happen to anyone.
Rick,
I agree. If he’s gone a year, everyone knows and he’s feeling like a failure. He’s probably feeling at wit’s end and this is his last ditch effort. His request might just be a plea to stop him and help him find another answer.
Yeah, Sheila,
It is a thought. Who could I call if I was about to lose my house? The answer to that question really does say something about the people on that list. Doesn’t it?
Listen .. I get fed up going to my local bank and exiting the shopping center at the light, where .. if it’s not some guy begging me to support him because he’s too proud to beg although that’s what exactly he is doing .. or how about the other ones wanting to clean my windshield and will practically throw mud on it hoping to hold my windshield hostage. Fortunately, my middle finger works and I have a loud stereo.
But, like Rick suggested .. this isn’t about donating to a bum or a decent person having problems .. I will take it from the position that the person is asking me for advice FIRST to give him permission to beg in public on his blog.
My answer would be something similar to the feed a man to fish or teach him how to fish philosophy. A year is too long to be sitting on a mortgage and getting worse in debt. It’s all about cash flow, and pride and believe it or not – there are lots of jobs out there in the real world – if you are willing to do it. I bet this person has many credit cards, and still active and using them to kyte payments on the other credit cards. He probably has a cell phone and now he’s blogging? I wonder how many payments he has left to owe on his new laptop and I also wonder how much he is paying for internet access?
I would recommend that he put the house up for sale, cut the credit cards in half with scissors, use the proceeds of the sale of his house to pay off the mortgage and credit cards and settle on a fixed monthly amount to retire any remaining debt. Then, sell the laptop, stop leasing the Mercedes Benz and take any job that he can to feed and support his family that he can, even if means becoming a renter, living with the in-laws, etc. etc. and maybe he will get back on his feet.
Stress can kill you know. It must be eating him up alive being in all that debt and once he solves that situation .. everything might fall into place.
I’m sure everyone hates me now 🙂
HART,
Who could hate you? Your advice isn’t outlandish or even cruel. It could very well be the truth of the situation. Plenty of people have gotten that far into debt doing exactly what you describe.
And credit counselors advice is to start by cutting up the credit cards and moves right down the line through what you describe.
So, are you going to do it? 🙂 🙂 🙂
Something drastic has to be done .. a year later is not “falling on hard times” .. it’s gross mis-management of your life and your resources.
It’s like that commercial about drugs .. a 40-year old guy claims that drugs never hurt him or affected his ability to make something out of his life … then in the background you hear is mother yelling and asking if he cleaned up the basement today and got a job. (I wish I can find that commercial on YouTube~!)
But HART,
Don’t they say if you’re at an upper management level it takes a year to get another job?
Now that really cuts the cake – if that was the situation Liz .. An Ex-CEO waiting and looking for a job?
I once read somewhere on the internet (so it must be true) that the average number of careers a person has in his/her life is five. I think that is probably understated given the advent of technology, computers, wi-fi and home office, changing from corporate structures to individual ones. If he’s in upper management waiting for a job interview .. I think my counselling should go towards his wife! Time for a divorce! lol
Just checking, HART. Just checking.
All points well taken. He has to be interviewing for the statistic to have meaning.
No I didn’t mean an ex-CEO, an ordinary VP of Operations at a mid-size company, in his 50s laid off from downsizing.
Downsizing is becoming more and more common place .. unfortunately ..
It’s one thing to worry about your retirement, and another to worry about reaching it. It’s a changing world out there – not static.
Yeah, I know. There is no such thing as job security only the illusion of it.
Its a bit late in the conversation, but what the hell — here are my 3 cents.
With all the talk about “begging”, what I’d do is try and get all the bloggers together for a more business-minded proposition if one had the time and contacts.
Rather than just ask for ‘donations’ — set up something like a single page ebook / report / guide sale.
You could even make it about blogging. 😉
Get all of your blogging friends to contribute a page on a given topic, and then get them to help promote the book to their audiences for a good cause (the blogger in question).
Get the blogging friends to throw in their own goodies (if they have them) as any bonuses (links, favours, free hosting etc etc) and you might just have something.
Cheers
t @ dji
Wow Tony, What a great idea!
You’ve got me thinking now that we should do a Successful blog memory book — just because it sounds so cool.
Why not?
And if you’re going to do it — do it up right with a professionally bound book at blurb.com or maybe even Lulu.com
And while we’re at it … we could donate the profits a liz-minded charity of your choice!
Then, we could do it every year around this time to celebrate successful-blog’s birthday — and create positive attention to blogs everywhere.
… anyone else want to jump in? 😉
t @ dji
Blurb.com? Lulu.com? That’s why they pay Tony the big bucks.
If by “big bucks” you are referring to cheese sticks and the occasional Tim Hortons double-double … then yes, Hart.
I swim in lakes of toonies. 😉
I’m with the ‘NO’s’ for asking money on a blog.
You mentioned that the blog has a large community. In any blogging community there are more lurkers than posters. They may or may not feel a part of the community.
Those that do feel they belong are there because of the trust that has grown over time. Trust comes slow but can be lost quickly.
Giving money to people does strange things to relationships. It changes the rules. Changes the mindset. Changes the power structure. Thatââ¬â¢s why most friends donââ¬â¢t bring money into a relationship. Itââ¬â¢s the fear of losing what they hold dear.
Also, anyone who was a witness to the request, no matter how desperate or true, will keep it at the back of their mind. They will remember whenever they read the name of the blogger even if itââ¬â¢s elsewhere.
A future mention of a holiday or a wild splurge, or even a preference for expensive coffee from the community blogger will bring up the money memory. Doubts may follow. Doubts about the character of the person asking for help. Sadly, itââ¬â¢s human nature. When people give money, invisible strings become attached. Some may even start keeping score.
Most here will remember the popular blogger who made a request for money from his readers so he could blog full time. A year later and blogs were full of how he handled it. Some were not complimentary. I guess the trip to Europe didn’t go down well with those who opened their pockets. Even so, those who didnââ¬â¢t donate had the loudest voices in protest.
As mentioned, savekaren.com was an excellent idea to get out of debt but it’s already been done, so …
Also mentioned, giving something in return may be the best answer to a money problem.
But I agree with HART, if it’s already to the point of giving up a house then perhaps it’s too late.
Too late and … past time to restructure bills, downsize living expenses, pull in the gut and do without.
Itââ¬â¢s an awful experience to go through. I know because Iââ¬â¢ve done it several times. When way younger I attempted to make it as a portrait artist. Well, at least I was thinner from the experience. Then when my son was in kinder I separated. We lived on peanut butter and jelly sandwiches for six months. Renting a house without aircon in East Texas during the summer was tough. Going without hot water wasnââ¬â¢t difficult for me because it was so sweltering hot, but my son having to take cold baths was awful. Another time found us in a big city without a job (plans fell through). After selling everything of value (items I dearly loved), I took a low paying job to cover rent and food until an interview came good. There was no xmas that year. No xmas for an eight year old boy. He was a trouper. We stripped down to nothing and eventually built back up.
Liz, for this mystery person you gave the age at about 50. When I was younger it was very hard to do. Being older, Iââ¬â¢m thinking it would be twice as hard to come out the other side. At 50 there is so much life behind. At 50, the time ahead to gather in savings is shorter, a daunting task to undertake.
Suggestion – get out the pencils and paper and get that business plan nailed down. Start today. Be realistic. There are things that will have to go to make it work. A lifetime of things – cherished stuff and comfortable habits.
If I were in this position myself, and given my lack of financial planning ability it’s not outside the realms of possibility, I would start by approaching organizations that want to help me. Organizations that help families with food, clothing, furniture and toys at Christmas. This is a blow to my pride but much easier than begging as you are taking something from someone who wants to give it to you and doesn’t know you personally.
If it came to asking for money I wouldn’t stand on a roadside and beg, I would play the bagpipes badly or become a squeegee bandit. Similarly on a blog I wouldn’t beg for money, I would find some way to motivate people to give me money, one little red paperclip style. I would have to fail at a few of these attempts before I went for flat out begging.
I would find it difficult to have my online begging exposed on the net forever and for my kids to find in a Google search years from now.
regards
Vincent
Tony,
I love your energy and your idea. We will pursue at Open mic night.
Hey HART,
Tony makes the same kind of big bucks that we do. If they we’re much bigger, he wouldn’t have time to hang with us in the comment box. 🙂
Cat,
You always speak from knowledge and experience I appreciate that. It adds so much to the discussion to have your depth and detailed view point.
Let’s twist the tale by adding some story to it. Maybe he was doing fine, got laid off, and then was hit by two or three bad turns — serious damage to his home, an expensive illness, and a car that died.
Add to that the fact that he’s an optimist who got caught up in taking small jobs to pay small bills, thinking he’d get back in the workforce at the 6-figure income he once had.
Bad things do happen to good people.
Hi Vincent,
Organization are fine idea. They do require a trade off. At the very least they require the person admitting to himself that he is in trouble. Maybe he just needs someone to go there with him.
I’m like you. I’d have to find a way to make something of value in trade.
I don’t money. I need work. That is what I’ve been saying.
Heh heh … I look forward to it, Liz (rubs hands together).
In all seriousness, why ask for money when, with the “un” economics of the web these days, you can easily and cheaply set something up of value so you can do a worthwhile exchange?
(some would call it a business venture)
Hi Tony,
Good morning!
It would be so fun to have a Successful Blog scrapbook and the beauty of your idea is that it’s infinitely expandable / updatable / renewable without too much trouble. 🙂
We could give it out at the Successful Blog Convention in Chicago that Starbucker has suggested that we get planning. There will be a chocolate tasting, a real open mic night, and now a scrapbook. WAY COOL!!
ha ha! I love it.
But seriously — you could think about having at cost copies to SOB’s or whatever … but for all else, perhaps selling it just above cost.
Proceeds to go to some politically neutral cause of your choice, to be sold on some important day with an appropriate launch day set in mind.
All “SOB’s” could be recruited in getting the buzz started; we could have a little competition to see who get’s the most sold.
Send a press release (business communications any one?) … the whole enchilada.
Something to think on? 😀
I think it’s some thing to DO.
I think I’m with HART on this one. After a year there are life issues at play that are bigger than “finding a job.” One thing about my periods of unemployment is that they didn’t last long. I took work that was well “beneath” my nominal pay grade just to pay the bills.
(The hardest transition was when one company I worked for went belly up. I found myself going from the Manager of 3 marine terminals in the region to grunt labor at a terminal smaller than any of the t 3 I’d managed. No thinking required for the job but sometimes you just gotta pay the bills. Besides, Gorgeous really liked what that hard work was doing for my shoulders and my waistline! 😉 )
I’d have a long talk with my hypothetical friend to probe deeper into what is really going on in his head to find the root of the “can’t find work” problem. Work is out there, especially here in America. People who can’t find it aren’t really looking.
Even in the CEO example, he could do something while he searched for the right opportunity. In today’s market switching jobs doesn’t have nearly the stigma it did in days of old.
Amen!
Chris,
I’m not disagreeing with you or HART. I’m only filling in details to see how the story affects things. It’s already interesting that it seems a very male question — that is one that draws serious and strong emotional response from a predominance of guys.
I hear a lot of “If I can, you can. Give no quarter.”
Would there be no exceptions, ever?
Methinks you misunderstand me (a little). I’m not saying at all that I wouldn’t help out financially in this case. What I am saying is that the circumstances appear to be symptomatic of something else (bigger) going on.
By just tossing money at my hypothetical friend without helping him work through whatever the core issue is my help would be very superficial and have a rather short term effect (or is it affect? I forget.).
It’s the old story about giving someone a fish or teaching them to master fishing. Which serves my friend better? And teaching them to fish doesn’t mean we let them starve until they master the skill. It’s not an either/or but an all/both.
Oh, and men are generally more hard wired to get a larger portion of their significance from their work than women are. So it’s no surprise that us knuckle-draggers are speaking up louder. 😉
Oh no, Chris.
I never thought you’d leave the poor guy in the cold. I was just hearing a thread of manly undercurrent in the vibe of ALL the comments that seemed similar.
A simple observation of a detail that was. Nothing more.
All of you also say that he needs to take charge of his problem and fix it.
Yeah to that second comment. I had that thought too — well the part about men thinking about work more.
Not the knuckle dragging — honest! 🙂
Great comments Cat.
Without going into a lot of detail. I lost my father when I was a teenager. I watched my mother struggle to raise me and my younger siblings. She would do just about anything to make our lives better. I feel the same way.
I would do anything as a parent and husband to help my family. Begging for money would be easy if it meant my family would eat and have a place to live.
I would also help out another as much as I could. Knowing though that money is not always the best help, but it does help. If I was close to the person I would do my best to help him get some kind of long range plan so this didn’t happen again.
Big Roy,
I admire what you’re saying. I don’t think there’s a one of us who disagrees with you. I could be wrong. But I don’t think I am.
What do I say to this… I would go public.
Now having written that, it brings tears to my eyes to think about the courage it takes for one to go completely public, naked for the world to judge, and it looks like the world does judge.
The best of all, is that when you do, when you finally release that fear that has been raging silently, nagging at you to do something different because all you have tried in the past has become clouded and lead you to where you are today, you will become consumed with honesty. How can anyone who begs for money, asks for a donation or simply asks for a monetary contribution to their blog wreck their future prospects of employment (BS). Being financially poor is not a crime. What is the crime is that we are taught to stay “hush hush hush” about it for fear of a future, that may or may not even happen.
I have hope in humanity.
Jessica,
You write so well and so beautifully. I worry. The writing is good for the writer when written, but what of the world who does not believe? There on the screen is a person’s heart, a peron’s soul revealing, offering truth only to be received by an audience ready to find fault and tear it down. 1000 years online is a long time for such words to live . . . are you sure that online is that where they should be?
One thing Jessica brings up here I’ve wondered about also. I may be naive. I’ve never worked in the corporate world. How would doing this wreck his chances of getting a job? Would he really want to work somewhere that it did harm his chances? Is this an upper management thing?
Rick,
I wonder. . . . I used to think that if you had the resolve to ask me a question, I had the courage to answer it. Now I know that’s not a wise response. Borders and boundaries are good thngs. They help us value who we are and what we believe — to hold them sacred to us.
To put our fears and our worries out there where people don’t know us, have no context, no background with in which to set them seems to be inviting them to do what we do with these questions — to have opinions about us as if we aren’t real people with real lives and real histories.
Who are we disrespecting in that transaction not them, but us. They can’t know all of the details we don’t tell them so they fill in with what they imagine. We let them think things that aren’t true or aren’t real because how could we possibly tell them what brought us to the action that was happening for all to see? Forever online is a very long time . . . I don’t think we have yet learned to understand that. It may take generations for humankind to realize what that means.
What you just said is the main reason I don’t have a personal blog. People need a context, and if it isn’t there, we make it up. Borders and boundaries are necessary. Where they are is the result of who we are, and there are people you can be safe with, and those you can’t.
It’s not the people generations down the road I’m concerned about. What does it matter what they think about you? They may see me as a caricature. They may see me as a villain. They may see me as a fool. But I’m long gone and it can’t effect me. Descendants? Who hasn’t got family skeletons and family heroes? Unless it is someone in the extreme, no one will care what your ancestor did. For a historical record, personal blogs can do as much if not more than the letters and diaries of yesterday that have given us so much of our history.
It’s the people today that I’m concerned about. As I’ve seen someone else say it, I wouldn’t post anything online I wouldn’t want my mother to see. (Not that I would encourage her to go to my site. She always thought I was strange.) What you put online can affect other people who know you. My family, my friends. The effect of the posting on them, I care about. So personally I wouldn’t beg online anymore than I would beg at the airport.
I have the feeling I’m not saying what I want to say.
Rick,
I can’t assume what you wanted to say, that what you said you said eloquently and so clearly. People today see and hear and are affected by what is written here. There is responsibility as well as freedom in the expression that we have.
Your experience shines through, Liz. Two sentences to say what took me three paragraphs. I hope I’m that good some day. 🙂
But for now, good night.
Hi Liz,
Late coming back … computer problems again …
“Letââ¬â¢s twist the tale by adding some story to it. Maybe he was doing fine, got laid off, and then was hit by two or three bad turns ââ¬â serious damage to his home, an expensive illness, and a car that died. … Add to that the fact that heââ¬â¢s an optimist who got caught up in taking small jobs to pay small bills, thinking heââ¬â¢d get back in the workforce at the 6-figure income he once had. … Bad things do happen to good people.”
Bad things do happen to good people. I believe they happen to good people more than not.
The different replies here show many personal points of view. With their own past experiences, each are asking us to take their personalities into account.
There have been the generous “sure, I’d gladly help” all the way to the “I’m tired of being asked for money” responses.
Each of the personality types will be mirrored in the community blogger’s audience. If a request for money goes out, each type will respond in kind.
Where am I coming from? I think it’s pretty safe to say that I’m not one to ask for help when it’s personal. When I’m in dire straits I disappear into a cave by distancing myself until stronger. I mirror this stance in the advice I give.
Depending on the government to help is also not something with what I’ve had a positive experience (I’ll refrain from a long, tedious story about the time I did try …). But others have been successful so it’s worth a try.
Taking my baggage and bits into account, the thought of blogging about the desperate need of money would not be in any advice I’d give a friend.
savekaren.com was funny to me but only after awhile. Being me, it was a shocker when I first read the idea behind the site.
Yes, I’ve tangled with the credit card demon and came to terms on what is smart and what is not.
Smart = a sharp pair of scissors
I believe in a simple, safe philosophy – if you don’t have it, don’t spend it.
And if you don’t have it, don’t ask to spend mine.
Not without an even exchange of something I need to further my future.
Harsh? Not to me. My pennies are all lined up and have a place waiting to go. Pennies coming in also have their little slots nicely planned.
Online begging was successful for Karen because enough strangers (kinder then me obviously) sent in money.
But here’s the twist. Karen started out as a stranger to most. From what I can tell, she stayed that way.
The community blogger in question is not a stranger to his members. Reportedly, he’s a friend to many.
The possibilities of this being a friend would strengthen my response against asking for money on a blog, not weaken it.
But again, that’s just me. I see possible permanent harm. Blogs can be your friend but they can also turn. So, just how thick skinned is the blogger in question?
And with the reality of the situation, can a six figure income be attained by requesting help online? Not that I can see.
Well, not unless he is the head of some airy fairy church of the far left nipple and can convince his followers of the need for a new supporting structure every year …
Question – If it’s to dig part way out of a hole and it works, then, what’s next? And why wasn’t the ‘what’s next’ used in the past year?
… as mentioned, if this person has trust in their government and banking system, then they could arrange a round of meetings and get a manageable financial solution sorted out.
… as mentioned, he could create a product his members would want to purchase. Something they could use. Something they needed.
If he doesn’t know what to offer, perhaps this is what he could ask of his members – what they’d feel would be an attractive product to them.
And that’s the sort of request I’d go for when asking for help. Asking advice on what to give back to the community.
Now turn the situation on its head. Let’s assume the community blogger has already put out a request for money.
Some were generous, some pitched in for the idea of it, others were embarrassed but gave a little, some left the community after giving nothing.
Let’s say the return was tiny.
So now the blogger is not only faced with foreclosure on the his house and everything else … and …
… what would he be feeling after opening up his personal finances to potentially millions of readers?
Rejected? Sure. And a whole range of other strong emotions.
And you can bet blog conversations would be peppered with the predicament. And not just the blog in question.
Now what?
Well, the make-up of the blog community just changed.
Forever I imagine.
And the hole becomes bigger, only now there are millions of people peering in …
Rick.
Don’t discount yourself. You did the thinking. I just summarized it.
Thank you for your thoughts. They are valuable.
Good night, friend.
Sleep well.
Ok this could come off harsh but why is it acceptable to blog about having a party to celebrate, getting a new job or even buying a new dress but not acceptable to blog about being down or poor or perhaps upset at what someone said?
It’s rare that a person wouldn’t blog about being happy, or for that matter landing a new job or welcoming a new family member. In those cases we as human beings are taught to celebrate.
On the flip side when things get rough I sense many bloggers will not go there into the depths of their own truth. But for those of who do write words of sorrow or overwhelmed with responsibility regardless of what form it takes i.e monetary, health, family… we seem to touch a very black and white area.
Why not.
I don’t know how to be anyone else but who I am. I have never had a canvas to paint upon that the whole world paints upon to. 1000 years of words, images, movement and noise that the future will disect, piecing together ideas and algorythms, in attempts to understand humans bewitched with blogging from the early 21st century.
Hi Cat,
Thank you for taking so much time and so much thinking to put on the screen the comment you did above. I find much practical advice and much wisdom in what you’re saying.
I think of Karen’s situation — which I note the irony that we’re analyzing here as if she’s not a real person — as a “million dollar homepage thing.” She had the idea and found a way to make her situation a form of “entertainment.” As far as I know no one knows what she looks like. Do we know that Karen is her real name?
So your point about conversations being peppered with the event is true even at this moment while I sit here typing this.
Your “Now what?” question is the crucial one for me. Has he been asking that all along? If he has, how did he get to this place?
Hi Jessica,
Why not?
Once when I was young, maybe 7 years old, I was in the car with my mother and a friend of hers and I revealed my mother’s age to the friend. My mom wasn’t a vain woman and I doubt that she cared, but at that moment she turned to me and said, “You must learn to keep the family business within the family.”
Why did she say that? She was trying to protect our family. It’s the familial version of “Loose lips sink ships.” People use information to hurt other people.
My father used to tell me “Watch out for your enemies and beware of your friends.” You know me well enough to know this lesson never sunk in. But I would ask him what he meant and he would say, “You’ll never let your enemies close, but your friends will be near enough to hurt you.” He was right about that.
It’s not that the expression is wrong.
I agree with you. I love this wonderful canvas on which to paint and paint I will too.
But I won’t put my paintings in middle of Lakeshore Drive for cars to run over them. I won’t put things online for people to abuse them either.
To me it’s not about letting other folks dictate what I do, it’s about me deciding what they will understand and value appropriately.
Some things about me only my closest friends know . . . that seems right. If everyone knew them, how would that change the meaning of being my closest friend?
So I’m reading this long, extremely well thought out and persuasive comment by Cat an I get to this line
I nearly fell out of my chair laughing! 😆 Brilliant!
Liz, I hear what you are saying about the risks of exposure. The danger is real. Rick said that the danger is exactly why he doesn’t have a personal blog.
But the rewards of bearing a piece of your soul, even on the permanence of the web, can make it worth the cost. I believe it. That is why I do have a personal blog (CREEations for those of you who may not know.)
The bottom line is that with this particular ethics lesson there is no right answer. Ultimately the answer to the original question, though, is it all depends. I might give the exact opposite advice to two of my friends who each found themselves in that spot, simply just by looking at their personalities alone.
Ah, Chris,
I’m not exactly un-soul-bearing on my writing blog either, but the operative words here are “a piece of your soul” not all of it. At least that’s what I think.
I am open and honest when I am on fertile ground. I won’t stand in front of an oncoming train and think that I am safe.
Yeah. And I wouldn’t stand in my front lawn in my birthday suit either! 🙂 My neighbors would run in horror!
Good point.
Why Chris, your neighbors might surprise you! 🙂
Pah-leeze! Some things were meant to stay covered up, just like you said. 🙂
I know. I know. 🙂
I have a friend who says,
“The older I get the better I look with my clothes on.”
Liz,
“Your ââ¬ÅNow what?ââ¬Â question is the crucial one for me. Has he been asking that all along? If he has, how did he get to this place?”
Having done that, I can see how he could have arrived in this spot. Life gets in the way. He spends days putting out one fire, then another, all without looking at the problem from a distance.
We all know it’s easy to get swamped with everyday problems. A day becomes a week then the months roll by and a year has gone. I’ve done it myself. Waking up in a panic to the knowledge of a year wasted is not a treat.
Christmas is coming up. How many of us said “I’m going to lose 15 pounds before the holidays” and are now being squeezed due to the lost time?
Chris,
“I nearly fell out of my chair laughing! 😆 Brilliant!”
Glad to give you a giggle. 🙂
I was trying a bit of tongue and cheek with the “supporting structure” but it didn’t quite connect.
Yeah, Cat,
We both know I have my own share of guilty. Now what? Is one of the hardest questions in life I must think.
The subject of begging was timely.
Thailand is a country where you could say begging is a profession. In shifts, there are organised gangs who drop off carloads of beggars at intersections popular to tourists, shoppers and Thais getting to work.
The beggars sit themselves down along freeway walk-overs or along busy side-walks.
Note: They are not intrusive as in other third world countries.
There’s one guy with terrible physical problems who drives himself to ‘work’ everyday on his three wheel bike. Parks it in an alley and crawls face down along the side-walk with palms outstretched.
Babies are doled out to women to gain sympathy. Reports say the babies are drugged to keep quiet.
I’m pretty confident that the money does not go into most beggars pockets but back to the gangs. It took several years before I could be casual about passing a cup.
I walk by beggars on the way to my local grocery store and generally ignore them.
I do have a favourite old man on my soi who I occasionally give a few baht, but I’m certain he’s legit. Sometimes I give 20 baht and occasionally I surprise him with more to give myself a smile. (I’ve tried different sums to change his expression and it doesn’t, so I do it for my own grins).
From what I can see from his cup, the Thais drop in small money. The tiny brown coins.
Exchange rate – 100 Thai baht is about US$3.
100 baht doesn’t seem much, but you can eat on the street for less then 100 baht – ten baht if you are frugal.
The Thais aren’t going to give beggars 100 baht. At the most it’s 20 baht = US$ 0.55. More likely it’s all the annoying small change no one spends (I don’t have a clue what those are worth).
Getting to my story … yesterday, due to computer problems, I had to taxi around Bangkok trying get it sorted.
Coming out of Pantip Plaza (well known computer mall for software rips) there was a western backpacker sitting on the ground at the corner of the walk-over. He was holding a sign “Out of money – 100, 200, 1000, 2000 baht, anything would be a help. Will work …”
I’ve never seen a westerner begging. Also, with this subject on my mind I wasn’t sure what to do. I stopped and backtracked a bit, then turned my back to give it some thought.
Could I easily walk past a fellow countryman? Sure I could, but knowing what I know about how Thais feel about westerners …
Thais believe all westerners are rich. My assumption – he wouldn’t have much luck.
On the other hand, Pantip Plaza is full of western tourists buying illegal software. They might give him a bit just for the lark of it all. The tourist westerners I know believe 500 to 1000 baht is small change so he could make enough to last him a week or so. 1000 baht is a lot of money to me so maybe you have to live with the currency and cost of living to know its worth?
Making up my mind, I walked over, put 100 baht in his direction and wished him “good luck”.
Why? Two reasons.
One – Because his “will work” was hilarious. Almost a ‘Save Karen’ plea just not as clever.
Minimum wage in Thailand is a little over 100 baht a day. That’s what the government has set so a number will get less. Also, why would anyone hire an unknown westerner? And for what? A decent part-time maid is 500 baht a day … but … again, a stranger in the house?
Two – Because the Thais (most likely) wouldn’t give enough to help.
Did I believe he was honestly out of money? 50 / 50. I had to look into his face a couple of times to make up my mind. I’m still not sure. I was going for the experience of it more than anything else.
Would I have given up my taxi money if this conversation at Liz’s hadn’t occurred? I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t.
Btw – his response to my “good luck” (or the 100 baht) wasn’t worth 100 baht.
😀
Liz,
It’s not just you.
I’m also doing the “Now what?” the best I can.
I look back and, all things considered, believe I’ve done well with what I’ve accomplished in the past ten years.
I know I need to take that knowledge and experience and place it forward into my new life.
I’m excited. Excited and a bit scared.
What a sad ending to your story — the guy could have had a bit of gratitude, a simple hello, a smile, a thank you. Why is it we think that we can interact with each other and not acknowledge another’s humanity.
I’m sorry that happened. Things like that are the reason people quite taking chances on each other. 🙁
Liz,
Yes, a hello would have been nice. With a positive conversation I would have seen clear to offer more. But not as it stood.
A smile back would have sufficed. Especially in Thailand, the land of smiles.
If pressed, I’d say a smile is worth more than 100 baht.
I should have asked for change back …
(hehhhehhhhhh ….)
Or maybe this.
Excuse me sir, Let me look at that 100 baht again. Oh I could never give you that, it’s the money my maid cursed last week. I must get to a church immediately.
Then run away. 🙂